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I
still find it hard to believe that traditional numbered money storage
accounts don't exist. They pay a negative return (user fees but no
interest payments) and have the "full faith and credit" of Swiss banks.
As long as neither party blabs . . . .
If
the IRS is so effective at bringing tax cheats, using foreign
accounts, to justice, how did Paul Manafort get away with cheating
for so long. It took Robert Mueller and dozens of dedicated
prosecutors to bring him to justice and they don't work for the
IRS. If Manafort hadn't been associated with Trump, he'd still be
getting away with massive tax evasion.
The
IRS has made expat life hell. It is impossible to keep US accounts and
ads and foreign banks and brokers are reluctant to provide services
because of the risks of FACTA. In addition the tax system is
complicated and unfair. The idea that you should pay US taxes for
no services is already twisted. In addition IRS tries to apply the US
tax code to your foreign tax bill. At least look at net tax paid
abroad vs net tax theoretically due in the US and only require the
difference (as well as allowing "overpayment"to be rolled forward as a
future credit). Most expats not only pay their taxes but are also
small fry. As the article notes $16Bn has been raised from 50,000 many
of whom are not even expats vs 7MM expats. If non-taxation of overseas
operations of companies is ok, why not the same for individuals?
Use the foreign tax credit to get back the taxes that you paid to the other country.
Subscriber
6 months ago
That
doesn't work if you live someplace with high expenses and high income,
while simultaneously keeping housing costs down. Like perhaps Hong Kong.
Overseas taxation is completely out of hand. Compliance costs thousands
every year, the taxes are most certainly not ZERO. Perhaps it should be
mentioned how difficult it is to plan for retirement when the banks and
my OWN government treats me like a criminal and uses FATCA as the whip
to keep me inline.
Subscriber
7 months ago
How does this article not even mention the Panama Papers expose’ ??
I
work with limited space, and the Panama Papers expose had far more to
do non-U.S. citizens than with U.S. citizens. As one D.C. criminal tax
lawyer said to me, "We knew this wasn't a big U.S. story because our
phones weren't ringing."
The U.S. crackdown did help inspire other crackdowns and information sharing globally. But that's another story . . .
THX.
Subscriber
7 months ago
Wiki listing Americans who were exposed in the Panama Papers leaks:
Numerous
donors to former US President Bill Clinton and former Secretary of
State Hillary Clinton, as well as to the Clinton Foundation and its
associated charities.[418][419]
The
U.S. tax system is terrible for expats (citizens residing
abroad). They must spend thousands annually to comply with the
U.S. tax and reporting requirements, and be subjected to additional
taxation, or risk having their passport revoked. The U.S. tax
system should be revamped to eliminate citizen based taxation, as is the
case for almost every other country in the world.
ABSOLUTELY.
I used to live abroad and it’s an abomination. Zero benefits and still
have to pay taxes. Nice being the only country in the world enforcing
such stupidity.
We we need to ENCOURAGE Americans to work and live abroad, not saddle them with unnecessary cost and headache
Well
look what it took to finally nail Manafort but at least those asset
forfeitures should more than cover the investigation costs.
This
is the other lucrative branch of corporate welfare. Big time money
launderers having no fear of detection, you just buy off the right
people right? Right Donny? Or get yourself elected as POTUS so you
can destroy the IRS or try.
Subscriber
7 months ago
Don't spam. There is a Manafort article on the front page. Post about Manafort there.
It's
not that hard to be in compliance with the new electronic forms and
filing. You do have to go around to your offshore banks and get
statements, convert currency, etc. I think that one bank that we have
pays us under $1 in interest per year but we report it anyways.
Subscriber
6 months ago
(Edited)
Yes
its easy to fill out a FBAR. It's not simple , easy, or cheap to
complete your return, though. Last year my federal return
was 90 pages, and I am just a corporate guy with some accounts in Canada
leftover after I worked there a few years.
So,
the IRS is panicked that you are not paying a few dollars of tax on the
tiny interest on your Swiss savings account? Do you also have to
pay tax on the interest to the Swiss? It seems like as long
as Dems are allowed in Washington, there is a rational reason for
keeping some money "out of their reach" oversees. Or is prudent
financial planning supposed to be illegal now?
So
disingenous my friend look at the level of fraud by Mr. Manafort alone
and he is hardly alone. . Oh and they probably haven't nailed
Manafort on all his crimes but this will do.
Are you trying to claim the GOP and conservatives in general have the moral high ground when it comes to money launderers?
When
I think of Switzerland, I think of tax evasion and money laundering.
It's a beautiful place, but I don't plan to visit there because for as
long as I can remember it has sought and made piles of money from
illegal financial transactions. I suspect the City of London may be
next.
Maybe
they could stop people flying out of Minnesota headed to Somalia with
suitcases full of cash defrauded from child care providers? These would
be the very same Somalis that Obama dumped on them whether they wanted
them or not. And then there's all the other mechanisms of transporting
money out of the US to terrorist strongholds.
But, Obama himself already flew $400M in untraceable cash to Iran. So it's all good because they're just following his example.
Looks
like all the crazies are out today. Trump hasn’t tweeted some
gigantic lie for them to defend so they have time to comment here.
This isn’t hard. The law is the law. Legally
avoid every tax you can, that’s why we have laws, but pay your taxes
when they are due and you’ll have no issues. Cheat the IRS you are
cheating your fellow citizen and you should be caught and prosecuted
for it,
Wayne
has not a clue what the issues are as he has not lived outside the US
nor had a foreign account as a US citizen to understand the requirements
and penalties. Draconian, and not in step with other
countries.
For
many, the tax law is not simple, not clear, and not consistent.
Defining many business expenses is subjective and the definitions are
ever evolving.
If you're a US citizen, working for a
foreign company in a foreign country, how US tax law applies to business
expenses is anything but clear.
Agreed.
Let’s immediately close all government programs and departments not
related to national security, law enforcement and the court system.
Imagine, the entire federal government could operate for $1 trillion a
year or less!
The
U.S. government, in particular the IRS, has legal jurisdiction over the
earnings of U.S. citizens whether or not those earnings accrue in the
U.S. or its territories. If you want to avoid this particular
anomaly you must renounce your U.S. citizenship and pay an exit tax.
The big boys hide their money in plain sight by setting up "charitable foundations."
Since
they are not only rich, but also powerful, they can set up foundations
with the friends on the payroll and watching the money.
Appreciated
assets are contributed to the "foundation" and are sold in the
"foundations" name and never taxed. Even better, they get a tax
write-off for the "donation."
All of these wealthy, powerful
people do this. They never give their money directly to the Red
Cross, the Salvation Army, or the like
There is a reason why
these "foundations" are called the Ford Foundation, the Bill and Melinda
Gates Foundation, the Clinton Foundation. The get the tax
benefits and maintain control.
all
the time beating their chests about how philanthropic they are. of
course mark(mr. facebook) sets up a LLC to be able to dole out his tax
free money to lackies he prefers.
Subscriber
7 months ago
And
of course they then draw big salaries as employees of the foundations
while their expense accounts pay for the life style with private jets
and etc. The Clintons figured out this one.
You
forgot one important element of the "foundations". The
"benefactors" then typically go out and advocate for the estate tax,
while the "foundation" takes care of their children.
Wait
until they get their hands on your voting records. They have proven
themselves to be completely corrupt. It's easier to pay your taxes and
vote progressive if you follow their thought line and audit theory. Just
anotjer corrupt alphabet agency.
Subscriber
7 months ago
(Edited)
I've
often wondered why, in. the supposed freest country in the World, how
come the IRS goes after ordinary people who made mistakes in our
bizanteen tax law? Maybe I'm wrong, but I have heard stories of
raids and confiscation against grandpas and grandmas. If I'm
wrong, tell me. If the IRS is really warm and genteel, let me know that
too. Or is the federal government running a huge money laundering scheme
where their employees, on average, make a lot more than the ave.
citizen?
I’ve
been audited and made mistakes on my returns over the years. I
found the IRS to be well behaved, factual and easy to work with.
They WILL come after you if you lie, cheat or steal, as they
should.
the
big boys will be fine. they use sophisticated means of concealing
money offshore. the little guy, not so much. the little
guy cannot afford the tax magicians that the big guys can afford.
as usual therefore, the squeeze is on the little guy.
I
would have believed you until recent events show that the rich just
seem to be getting greedier and greedier and as noted they have
the means to hide it better.
17
billion sounds like a lot of money but it's only about a weeks worth of
spending. Once that's gone it's gone. This isn't a lake of cash fed by
an underground stream. The FATCA rules punish low income earners overseas and return pennies to the Treasury. It does way more harm than good.
What share though? Why do expats -- non-resident U.S. citizens -- need to pay taxes into a system they don't use?
And
before you say "State department, emergency evacuations!",
know that you pay a fee per service at the consulate, and the marines
aren't going to sweep in and evacuate American citizens at a time of
crisis (seriously, that's laughable).
Look at it this way, Art:
Let's say you were born in NY and moved to CA at some point in your life.
NY
passes a law saying that anyone who has an NY-issued birth certificate
must report their global income and pay tax on that to New York,
regardless of where the person lived. If your bank in CA
doesn't comply, then the authorities in NY cut their access to the
financial markets.
Would you think it's fair that you, as a resident of CA, has to pay another state tax on your local income?
Of course you don't. But that's the reality for millions of honest Americans living abroad.
17
billion sounds like a lot of money but it's only about a weeks worth of
spending. Once that's gone it's gone. This isn't a lake of cash fed by
an underground stream. The FATCA rules punish low income earners overseas and return pennies to the Treasury. It does way more harm than good.
Subscriber
7 months ago
Gee, someone at the IRS should send Trump a warning tweet before Mueller brings the hammer down on poor Don The Con's head.
Subscriber
7 months ago
Gee, someone at the IRS should send Trump a warning tweet before Mueller brings the hammer down on poor Don The Con's head.
Welcome
By joining the conversation you are accepting our community rules and terms. You also agree to the public display of your profile, including your name, and your commenting history. Please email feedback and questions to moderator@wsj.com.
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The conversation will close on this article 48 hours from publication.
Most expats not only pay their taxes but are also small fry. As the article notes $16Bn has been raised from 50,000 many of whom are not even expats vs 7MM expats. If non-taxation of overseas operations of companies is ok, why not the same for individuals?
I work with limited space, and the Panama Papers expose had far more to do non-U.S. citizens than with U.S. citizens. As one D.C. criminal tax lawyer said to me, "We knew this wasn't a big U.S. story because our phones weren't ringing."
The U.S. crackdown did help inspire other crackdowns and information sharing globally. But that's another story . . .
THX.
Numerous donors to former US President Bill Clinton and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, as well as to the Clinton Foundation and its associated charities.[418][419]
We we need to ENCOURAGE Americans to work and live abroad, not saddle them with unnecessary cost and headache
This is the other lucrative branch of corporate welfare. Big time money launderers having no fear of detection, you just buy off the right people right? Right Donny? Or get yourself elected as POTUS so you can destroy the IRS or try.
Are you trying to claim the GOP and conservatives in general have the moral high ground when it comes to money launderers?
But, Obama himself already flew $400M in untraceable cash to Iran. So it's all good because they're just following his example.
https://www.minnpost.com/new-americans/2018/05/what-you-need-know-about-somali-money-transfers-and-mysterious-bags-full-cash/
This isn’t hard. The law is the law. Legally avoid every tax you can, that’s why we have laws, but pay your taxes when they are due and you’ll have no issues. Cheat the IRS you are cheating your fellow citizen and you should be caught and prosecuted for it,
The USA has gone scumbag.
Guess what Wayne, you’re a Marxist.
Its not your place to tell others on the board to shut up.
If you're a US citizen, working for a foreign company in a foreign country, how US tax law applies to business expenses is anything but clear.
Return the federal guvmint to its constitutional duties, and its expenditures would be a small fraction of what they are today. #FACT
Typical Trump minion.
Many more to come.
Nearly every Criminals in Jail are ....democrats.
Ain't that the truth? It's going to be so cozy for the clueless millennials when they grow up and realize what they voted for.
Since they are not only rich, but also powerful, they can set up foundations with the friends on the payroll and watching the money.
Appreciated assets are contributed to the "foundation" and are sold in the "foundations" name and never taxed. Even better, they get a tax write-off for the "donation."
All of these wealthy, powerful people do this. They never give their money directly to the Red Cross, the Salvation Army, or the like
There is a reason why these "foundations" are called the Ford Foundation, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the Clinton Foundation. The get the tax benefits and maintain control.
I guess those 56K were not "big boys" huh? lol
The FATCA rules punish low income earners overseas and return pennies to the Treasury. It does way more harm than good.
And before you say "State department, emergency evacuations!", know that you pay a fee per service at the consulate, and the marines aren't going to sweep in and evacuate American citizens at a time of crisis (seriously, that's laughable).
Look at it this way, Art:
Let's say you were born in NY and moved to CA at some point in your life.
NY passes a law saying that anyone who has an NY-issued birth certificate must report their global income and pay tax on that to New York, regardless of where the person lived. If your bank in CA doesn't comply, then the authorities in NY cut their access to the financial markets.
Would you think it's fair that you, as a resident of CA, has to pay another state tax on your local income?
Of course you don't. But that's the reality for millions of honest Americans living abroad.
Criminal.
The FATCA rules punish low income earners overseas and return pennies to the Treasury. It does way more harm than good.